another quick Intercooler Q

[ricehunter]

So the people at SSAC haven't answered any of my emails... so I'm not to confident in giving them any money. I figure I can make a better IC setup from silicone intakes/frozen boost, I was wondering if anyone had the angles needed to making piping from the FMIC to the throttle body. I'm thinking about just doing 3" piping all around for anything I could be doing in the future.

[Wazzelby]

Honestly, the angles can vary a bit depending on the vehicle. The best thing to do is measure and mock up as you go. This way you will get the best fit possible for your car.
I have 3" tubing all the way from the turbo to the TB and would rather drop down to 2.5" if possible. If you want to save money and get the 2.5" I'll gladly trade you my 3" :-)

[ricehunter]

Hmmm, I may take you up on that, just wondering is it for the SI core (type 0) and do you want all the piping done or do you just want the pipes?

I was thinking possibly 2.5 pre intercooler then 3" after just because I know my little T28 is gonna be sweating trying to fill all of that tubing at 16~17 PSI.

[Cloud]

There isn't really any need for 3" ic piping... I'm pretty sure guys have made like 500+whp on 2.5 and it makes life in the engine bay a lot easier.

[ricehunter]

Yea, i was just doing the calculations and I relized that the 1g Throttle body that I have is 60mm (2.3") so 3" piping would just need to be reduced once it got to the TB. So it looks like I'll go with the 2.5" and I know I'll most likely not do +500 WHP with this car so I see how that's over kill.

[burnett03]

I can get you in touch with a guy that can get you the ssac fmic.. I believe the price is around 300$ too.. It's where i got mine from.

[ricehunter]

That would seriously be cool. How hard id it to tap the 1G flange for the GReddy setup... I've heard all you have to do is tap 2 holes a little closer together. What size are the pipes?

[burnett03]

That would seriously be cool. How hard id it to tap the 1G flange for the GReddy setup... I've heard all you have to do is tap 2 holes a little closer together. What size are the pipes?

pipes are 2.5 inch.. All you do is put the greddy bov on, mark the holes and drill them.. It's simple. I emailed him ill let you know what he says.

[ricehunter]

I'm waiting to see if I can pick up this GReddy FMIC from eBay, so far the bid is $40 + $20 shipping.

But LMK on that SSAC when you hear back.

[thiazole]

BTW, if you are thinking about mixing sizes, do 3" before the intercooler and 2.5 after. The air before the intercooler is much hotter and would technically need more space to exert the same pressure.

[burnett03]

Sounds like a bottle neck situation if you do 3 to a 2.5 piping.. Don't bother with the greddy cores.. To much piping, small piping, and the core is easily damaged.. Email the guy about the SSAC fmic kit at majorboost@hotmail.com he's a great guy and will get it for you.

[thiazole]

More like funneling, if anything (although technically, because of the temperature gradient, it isn't either, but I won't get into that again). A bottle neck is where you go from a bigger tube to a smaller tube then back to a bigger tube. Going from a bigger tube to a smaller tube won't have the same effect - I bet your preturbo intake starts out much bigger than the inlet of your turbo. I'm sure you agree that flows better than a full 2 1/4 inch tube all the way from the air filter to match the turbo inlet...

[burnett03]

Going from a bigger tube to a smaller tube won't have the same effect - I bet your preturbo intake starts out much bigger than the inlet of your turbo. I'm sure you agree that flows better than a full 2 1/4 inch tube all the way from the air filter to match the turbo inlet...

Never thought of it that way, makes sense..

[ricehunter]

Hmmm, similar to what was discused in the exhaust thread... I just thought the rule of thumb is never neck down, like going from a 3" to a 2.5" but I guess that's just after the intercooler. Any more thoughts? Would there be anything wrong with using 2.5" piping going from Turbo to TB?

I'm guessing if I want to connect the SSAC FMIC I'll have to get a 180* pipe to redirect it from the 90* elbow comming off of the turbo.Or should I just get an extention piece and use a 90* coupler comming off of the elbow?

I also know they make diffrent compressor housings for the T28 that directs the outlet straight down, how much would one of these run?

[Zeppelin]

You can just cut the compressor housing to make it a straight shot down. You'll need to make a lip for it so the intercooler pipes won't blow off though.

I've also seen setups where the cut the housing and clock the outlet 180* to point it towards the intercooler.

[thiazole]

Hmmm, similar to what was discused in the exhaust thread... I just thought the rule of thumb is never neck down, like going from a 3" to a 2.5"

I used to think the same thing, but the more I think about it, I'm pretty sure it is best to either keep everything the same size or neck down a little bit. If you neck up, you slow the velocity of the air right before it enters your intake. That will kill your air flow IMO. I think having faster air flow before it enters the intake kind of crams air into the engine better. Of course, there is a point where the air velocity gets too high (around 300mph) and becomes very turbulent. You'd have to have surprisingly small tubing on your car to hit that, though.

[Cloud]

If we had no bends at all the tubing would be tiny to hit that velocity, but there are a lot of bends and a lot of horrible transitions in most ic pipes which is why for the most part larger tubing still makes more power. Bends accelerate flow, and they increase velocity a lot at the outside radius. Poor transitions hurt the most of anything because you get swirl effect and eddies even if your velocity is low.

[thiazole]

Which explains why press bent tubing is especially bad - a turn and a smaller diameter.

I was doing some large scale chemistry a while back and was using a 60 liter separation funnel (basically a large glass container with a valve on the bottom so that you can separate nonpolar compounds from polar compounds by creating a biphasic mixture of water and an organic solvent - the polar compounds dissolve in water and the nonpolar compounds dissolve in the organic solvent). When I'd open the valve about half way, the solvent would flow out very quickly - almost as fast as water comes out of a faucet a full flow. If I opened it all the way, it would almost immediately start to vortex and the flow rate would drop to a trickle (because instead of flowing in a straight line, it was now flowing in circles around the circumference of the tubing, so while the velocity of the liquid was probably the same, it probably had to travel 10X further to get through the drain tube). It was one of those weird moments when I realized that this same thing could probably happen while trying to flow air through an engine and could seriously kill horsepower. I'm just not sure what phenomenon I was seeing.

[ricehunter]

Ok, so I lost the auction for the GReddy, I wasn't going to pay more than $150 for it. So my question now is should I go with the SSAC (not sure of the size, they never answered me and I haven't emailed burnett03's guy yet) for $300 or for about $450 get the SI core (type 1) and do the piping (2.5") and everything myself.

[burnett03]

SSAC core.. Trust me on this you will love it and it'll handle whatever you throw at it. Also pretty easy to install. The ssac kit is massive.. I can post some pictures of my install so you can see.

[burnett03]

I also know they make diffrent compressor housings for the T28 that directs the outlet straight down, how much would one of these run?

I've seen alot of people use part of the stock IC hose to make the turn to connect to the ssac kit.

[ricehunter]

The Stock LICP? I was thinking I could either buy a 180, if you can find a pic or specs I'd greatly appreciate it.

[prophecymiller]

Here (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/DSM-2ND-GEN-95-99-Super-FMIC-2g-DSM-FMIC-Upgrade-KIT_W0QQitemZ230202186233QQihZ013QQcategoryZ33602Q QssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem)

If I could do it over again, I probably would have gone with a Precision intercooler. But for the price and package, it's hard not to like this kit...

You are going to need to cut the compressor housing if you want to do a nice install...there just isn't really enough space to try and put another elbow in there unless you want a really sharp bend.

[ricehunter]

Here (http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/DSM-2ND-GEN-95-99-Super-FMIC-2g-DSM-FMIC-Upgrade-KIT_W0QQitemZ230202186233QQihZ013QQcategoryZ33602Q QssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem)

If I could do it over again, I probably would have gone with a Precision intercooler. But for the price and package, it's hard not to like this kit...

You are going to need to cut the compressor housing if you want to do a nice install...there just isn't really enough space to try and put another elbow in there unless you want a really sharp bend.

Yea, that's the SSAC kit, I guess that's the kit that I'll get. So when modifying the compressor housing would I just cute off the elbow and put a bead around the edge to hold the silicone coupler or would I do a 45* and rotate the elbow to point straight down? What would I use to cut it?

[burnett03]

Yea, that's the SSAC kit, I guess that's the kit that I'll get. So when modifying the compressor housing would I just cute off the elbow and put a bead around the edge to hold the silicone coupler or would I do a 45* and rotate the elbow to point straight down? What would I use to cut it?

if you cut it you must put a bead on it.. Personally i'd do what i said and use the stock intercooler pipe.. Most people use the 180 and cut the stock intercooler pipe to connect to the ssac fmic

[ricehunter]

Ok, found it on Tuners
http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b107/synonyx/FMIC%20install/IMAGE_00061.jpg

Thanks for all the help. I email'd the guy, hopefully I'll hear form him on monday.

So are the couplers & t-bolt clamps any good, should I order any from SI?

[burnett03]

Ok, found it on Tuners
http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b107/synonyx/FMIC%20install/IMAGE_00061.jpg

Thanks for all the help. I email'd the guy, hopefully I'll hear form him on monday.

So are the couplers & t-bolt clamps any good, should I order any from SI?

t bolt clamps and couplers are good, i believe the kit is missing one clamp though

[burnett03]

http://www.dsmtalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1828451#post1828451

[ricehunter]

Yea, I can't get on talk, they suspended my account for "selling" in the newb area. I created another one, but I think I have to wait 7 days to view it. is it similar to this tread: http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/bolt-tech/276786-ss-autochrome-fmic-kit-install-w-t25-automatic-tips.html#post151344572

[burnett03]

No that thread is for an ssac fmic kit with all new couplers and tbolt clamps for 300$ shipped

[ricehunter]

Yea its going to be a week before I can view it, I sent that guy an email... Checking my email every now and again.