Stuck Axle

[TerryLiv]

91 AWD DSM. I am trying to remove my right front axle from the tranny. It will not budge. It won't pop out of the circular snap groove.

I tried to pound it out from the other side, but I believe the Phantom Grip must be blocking it.

The only thing I can think of is that it must be twisted in the spline.

Thoughts? How to remove?

Terry

[Cloud]

I use a pry bar against the tulip and really lay into it pretty hard to pop the snap ring free. That axle was always 'stuck' for me but always came out with enough leverage and dropping my body weight into the pry bar pretty hard.

[TerryLiv]

I use a pry bar against the tulip and really lay into it pretty hard to pop the snap ring free. That axle was always 'stuck' for me but always came out with enough leverage and dropping my body weight into the pry bar pretty hard.

Brian,

I assume you are talking about when the tranny is in the car. Is this correct? I had been using a short 18" crowbar from underneath. This is the longest bar I have. I don't believe you can quite get it in the right position from the top. Do you agree?

If the tranny is in the car, how can you drop your body weight into the bar?

I have pushed or pulled with quite a bit of force and it is not budging. This is not the first axle I have pulled out of a DSM.

Terry

[Cloud]

Typically it is in the car, yes. Dropping your body weight meaning putting momentum into it. It's typically at a 45 degree angle to the ground with the pry bars I have used. It can be reached from the top though I usually go from the bottom. I use a pry bar that is most likely over 24" and still put a good deal of effort into it most times I remove one so it doesn't sound too out of the question for it to be the circlip still.

One thing to see if it is friction or if it is just the circlip at the end being especially difficult is to test for in/out play of the tulip itself, not the axle sliding in and out of the tulip but the splined portion into the transmission. Most of the axles I have found will have the splined portion slide in/out about 1/16th of an inch, give or take when installed in the transmission. If there is no end play at all then you might have some stuck splines.

Either way I see no better way than to add more force/leverage, perhaps rotating the axle a few times to see if you can find an easier position to get it to release.

[burnett03]

Pounding it from the opposite side is a bad idea IMO and it wont release it anyways. A single and swift action will usually pop it free.. Here is a video I did..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IBxxPb0b50g

Obviously this is a bit harder to do with the tranny in the car, but it's doable.

[TerryLiv]

Brian,

I took the tranny out with the axle intact. Within 30 seconds with the same prybar it popped right out. I looked at the circlip and it had some scraped areas on the OD. I haven't tried to smooth these out yet, or to slip the axle back in and out to see if there is any sticking, but plan to.

I am pretty sure I will find that the axle slips in and out fine without the circlip and after smoothing the OD of the circlip it will pop out much easier in the future.

Thanks for your help and suggestions.

Next to inspect the clutch. I am still wanting to make sure that the original metallic clunking when revving the engine at low RPM's was really caused by a very worn drivers side motor mount which I have since filled with window weld. The clutch/flywheel will be my last option.

Later

Terry

[TerryLiv]

Sure enough, it was the clutch and flywheel. All bolts were loose and everything is junk. Even the ring gear was loose

I am now looking for a twin disk. All suggestions are welcome.

Terry

[mitsunut]

Whoa..
What clutch/flywheel combo were you using?
Jim

[TerryLiv]

Jim,

It was a Fidanza and South Bend 6 puck. The goo I used to lock the bolts obviously didn't work well enough. Even the starter ring gear was loose.

Terry

[Cloud]

Pretty impressive that even the ring gear was falling off. At least you know what all your problems lately have been from though ;) The twin disk question still gets me a little as there aren't manufacturers that make streetable twin disks for the dsm yet to my knowledge. I am not talking about drivability as much as I am lasting more than 10k miles. Not that they can't, trucks and v8 sports cars get non-race versions of twin disk clutches all the time.

[mitsunut]

Sorry to hear of your bad luck. Road race engineering will lighten your stock awd flywheel . I haven't had it done , just have seen pictures . How did the pressure plate and disc look?
Jim

[drcustom]

Guessing that's a 6 bolt? I might have a nice lightened aftermarket one for a 7 bolt (not
Fidanza light, but much stronger).

Also, if you ever come south I'd be interested in the carnage :)

[Mirage]

Personally, I'd never use a RRE lightened flywheel. Or any modified factory flywheel for that matter.

I severely dislike using factory flywheels on anything that live at higher RPM than factory intended.

Granted I've never grenaded a flywheel, but I'd rather keep it that way. I've pulled some abused factory flywheels out of cars that looks like they should have let go long ago.

The cast iron develops micro cracks as heat gets put into it and gets cooled.

My recommendation? Anything chromoly and SFI certified. Any good twin disk manufacturer will have a SFI spec flywheel with their clutch package.

I've used both Tilton and QM/PTT for twin disks and both worked very well for me. I never had any issues other than warping a floater from a race weekend gone to hell. I had a Tilton triple that I never got around to using as my goals changed too fast for me to keep up (Long story).

For anything race related (drag or twistys) with anything more than 600hp, stick with the twin and learn how to preload and shift.

Anything less, a single disk clutch will do fine but reliability will still be an issue regardless of your setup.

Marcus

[TerryLiv]

Sorry to hear of your bad luck. Road race engineering will lighten your stock awd flywheel . I haven't had it done , just have seen pictures . How did the pressure plate and disc look?
Jim

Jim,

The pressure plate was cupped about 0.038" and looked like it had had a blowtorch taken to it. The sprung 6 puck had many small chunks falling off the surface. This was South Bends most significant disk material and PP springs. I am not sure what it would have looked like if the bolts had held. Possibly pretty good, but with the reduced spring pressure it must have slipped more than I noticed.

I am only glad that it gave the metallic clunking sound at low RPM's that caused me to tear everything apart until I found it.

The aluminum flywheel 6 bolt holes are elongated and larger than original. The removable surface of the flywheel too looks like a blow torch was taken to it. Lots of slipping.

Terry

[TerryLiv]

Brian,

I took the tranny out with the axle intact. Within 30 seconds with the same prybar it popped right out. I looked at the circlip and it had some scraped areas on the OD. I haven't tried to smooth these out yet, or to slip the axle back in and out to see if there is any sticking, but plan to.

I am pretty sure I will find that the axle slips in and out fine without the circlip and after smoothing the OD of the circlip it will pop out much easier in the future.


Terry

Regarding the problems taking the axle out. The circlip had been used too many times and was not as round as it should have been, causing it to grip too well. I smoothed it out and made it rounder and it goes in and out much better. No bent splines, which was what I was worried about.

Terry

[Cloud]

Puck clutches and slipping do not go well together. I had a friend destroy a 6 puck and act 2600 in one drive home when he was doing second gear starts after losing first. I am guessing either you drove this like a street disk and slipped it a lot on launches or it just never held the power you were hoping for and needed more clamp load for your current torque output.

My recommendation for a single is the 2900 with street disk, that worked great for me, or make the move to twin disk and never look back.

[hubbazoot (aka Jon Lewis)]

I have the same type of problem getting my right axle out. Every time I've removed the transmission, I end up just pulling apart the right CV boot, leaving the joint in the transmission and removing it that way. Once it's out of the car, you can fit a pry bar under there real easy.